How the councils trial recordings were secretly transferred out of the country: Gil Lavedra, Ledesma and Valerga discussed at the book fair

5:15 p.m. on Friday, May 12th. A very long line is waiting at the door of Alfonsina Storni’s room Book Fair to Participation inThe fortieth day of democracy: the trial of the military junta, a turning point in restoring the rule of law “Which will start in fifteen minutes. It’s not any encounter and there are expectations. It is in the presence of the judges Ricardo Gil Lavedra and Guillermo Ledesma And Jorge Valerga Araozrun by the journalist Mary O’Donnell, In this edition of the exhibition of interest.

The meeting space has a capacity of 80 people, but it is enough to locate the last one in line to know that it will not be possible. Five minutes later, the organization reports that there will be a change of room and that Victoria Ocampo – including Domingo F. Sarmiento – is the new site. The audience, on the run, enters the room(s).

Lavedra generationAnd Ledsma And Valerga They tour the difficult decisions they made because “military regulations were unworkable” and because nothing like this was ever done, they say October 1984 was the turning point, and how they managed to secretly copy the ruling – which today there are only four copies – in a place on rue laval and have transported 96 tapes “Between Stockings and Handkerchiefs” to Norway. Also the originals slept in a corridor and were goofing off, how they discussed among themselves, the character of each one and the close relationship between them. They talk about it all.

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Ricardo Gil Lavedra, Guillermo Ledesma, Jorge Valerga Aráoz, and Maria O’Donnell (Nicolas Stolberg)

“Gentlemen, get up,” he mutters to a man in the third row and adds, “Just like every session started, remember? I’m going to send a message to my wife,” he shares with his occasional seatmate at the start of the day. And it must be said: Seeing them sitting there is crowding. Also in the audience is the famous Argentine writer Claudia PineroAnd Ezekiel Martinez, Director of the show ; And Juan BoedoPenguin Random House Managing Editor. O’Donnell Each judge presents to closed applause – says so Leon Arslanyan He cannot come because he is sick – and the dialogue begins: how do you live alive Who is the judge?

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We are very grateful for the movie Argentina 1985“, Begins Lavedra generation, “because it made it possible to bring back such an important historical fact in the general consideration of the democratic transition.” He points out that the film succeeded in penetrating young people, who were born in a democracy “and who did not witness those events that were truly the pillar of that young democracy.”

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for his part, Ledsma He says he’s pleased aliveHe adds that it is “a chance to get to know each other.” Alphonsine And for members CONADEP“. Valerga Aroz CHe agrees with his companions and warns: The lack of political toughness has been criticized [a la película] And that has gone into the background.” He continues: “What is important is to renew the interest of young people in knowing what happened,” and he concludes: “We must take off our hats Santiago Miter And everyone who produced the movie.”

Alfonsín in the Cabildo on December 10, 1983 and the return to democracy (Victor Pugh)

O’Donnell inquires about the book Astronaut Brothers And the consultation on the context in which Raúl Alfonsín holds the presidency, the amnesty of the army and the possibility of the armed forces investigating themselves for crimes against humanity. In this regard, Gil Lavedra says that “to gain a dimension to Alfonsín’s position, it must be taken into account that Argentina did not exist in the world a precedent in which a civil court could judge crimes in the country.”

“When Alfonsin takes office,” Gil Lavedra continues, “Argentina is the first restored democracy”. Dictatorships in Uruguay, Chile, Paraguay, Peru, Bolivia and Brazil are part of this difficult context, where Argentina is “out of the ordinary, the normal.”

The powerful phrase arrives:Neither business nor the church nor the media want a trial“Jill Lavedra’s sentence. Ledesma continues in this tone: “It gives me the feeling that Alphonsine would have preferred the military to rule on this matterValerga Aráoz also comments on military trials by military personnel and delves into preventive prisons in Videla And Masera.

Videla and Massera (Reuters)

After some technical questions about the decision of why an oral trial should be held, comes a phrase that unleashes laughter: “We were initially pressured to do this behind closed doors and other shows i won’t say whoLedesma says. The audience is still hooked, and Heroes is recording one of the most important moments in our recent history. The meeting continues on how responsibility was assigned, how this trial was adapted, model case selection and how “the prosecution has done an exceptional job with the help of CONADEP.”

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The talking starts to die down as they start telling anecdotes. For example, when Ledesma recounts the trip to Norway to take the first copy of the judgment. “We literally carry it around in our purse,” he says. “We secretly made the copyWe were taking parts of the room [Nacional de Apelaciones en lo Criminal y Correccional Federal de la Capital Federal]Gil Lavedra details and continues: “The Negro (to refer to Ledesma) was the leader of all that administration. I don’t know who delegated us.”

Continue the journey:We took them to a place Calle Laval to take it to VHS and we had about 96 tapes left, we handed it out and they took out the bags with the socks and handkerchiefs”. “It was also an artisan job,” Gil Lavedra sums up.

Gil Lavedra, Ledesma and Valerga Arroz remember how they made copies of the trial to take to Norway (Nicolas Stolberg)

Valerga Araoz presented another interesting data: “The issue is that the originals that were in the Federal Chamber began to deteriorate.” because? According to Valerga Aráoz, “They were in a damp corridor, on Uruguay Street that was completely closed off. It was dangerous and anyone who wanted to make them disappear could do so by striking a match.”

Now they count There are four copies: one in open memory, one in the Federal Chamber, one in the University of Salamanca, and one with the judges. But, where can you see the full experience of the boards? “Nowhere,” they say, rather, “in the digitization of Norway, there are also missing parts.” And one piece of information: “What is in the University of Salamanca deterioration by 8% and One of the tapes was re-recorded with the serials“Argentina,” Gil Lavedra concludes.

Victoria Ocampo and Domingo F. Sarmiento’s rooms are full listening to 40 years of democracy conference with junta trial judges (Nicholas Stolberg)

If there is an interesting point, according to the judges involved in the meeting, it is it Point 30, tension with the government, which ordered that the senior officers, who occupied the district and sub-district command, should be prosecuted. “We couldn’t dictate it and we were facing offences,” says Ledesma. Next came the colored face uprisings.

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The conversation is about the bonds they built between them after the trial. Hence the title of his book, Gil Lavedra recalls: “They told us we were in a spaceship.” Astronaut Brothers– And also remember that the chambers are armed with a decree. Thus, it shows the hadith how some were “lightning and lightning” and others were “peace and love.” They laugh, they remember. “The sisterhood of astronauts is perfect,” says Ledesma. The laughter returns when thinking about how they get along.

The “40 Years of Democracy Day: The Trial of the Military Junta, a Turning Point in the Restoration of the Rule of Law” is coming to an end. The topic is laws due obedience And The last point. “We didn’t like it and the room broke,” says Gil Lavedra.

“We of the Chamber apply the law of obedience. It bothered us all and all that, but I think at that moment we should have also understood the difficult situation in which Alfonsin found himself and it was not appropriate for either of us to declare this law unconstitutional. I repeat, we apply it all day,” says Philerga Aráoz. The two agree that they had vigorous debates about these laws and their constitutionality. “Over time I’ve come to have a more permissive vision,” adds Gil Lavedra.

“Terrible. I look at them and they are people like you, who had to face the sons of bitches who made them shit,” says the guy in the third grade, who goes on to talk about the laws due obedience And The last point With a companion in his seat at the end, while the attendees rush to take pictures and talk with the heroes of one of the most important historical events for our country. Argentina.

Read on:

Ricardo Gil Lavedra reviews the trial of the councils: “It would have been easier to pass very severe sentences, but that would not have been in accordance with the law”
Argentina, 1985: Recollections of the Horror of the Junta Trial in First Person
The intimacy of a majlis rule set out in a pizzeria and signed on a napkin

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